Battle Plans for Irondell

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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Rory on Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:30 am

Hmm, I guess we could set off the fire wand after we take the second barracks before we take the north bridge.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Zeiss on Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:59 am

Again, let's not use that fire wand in a town. I don't want us to set it on fire by mistake.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Rory on Sun Nov 17, 2013 8:29 am

Yesss...let's do it...it callsss...

Why does everyone assume it's going to backfire on the user's face in a 20 mile explosion radius? I bet Rekarg could figure out more than we did when we checked it the first time we picked it up, now that we have a proper Yellow Mage to help us with that.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Zeiss on Sun Nov 17, 2013 8:45 am

As far as I know, Rekkarg isn't interested into the Exchange stuff. I don't know if he will help at all. I would not be surprised if he stayed in Holtburg.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Rory on Sun Nov 17, 2013 10:02 am

Well I'm not suggesting that he help fight or do any work, just Scan the wand. I'm sure informing him that we found it on the Fire Sanctuary and that it was made by Gaerlan will be enough to pique his interest.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by K on Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:04 pm

Just so you know. Given my track record, i am not touching that wand with a 10-foot pole.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Gwydo on Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:44 pm

Assuming the map is accurate (North-South) we need to come in from the North East as there are no towers on that end of town.

Other than that I really have no input for the strategy, just nothing deceitful. Distractions and strategy are all part of battle, but intentionally lying to your enemy is unethical and will not be tolerated. Evil or Very Mad
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Archengeia on Sun Nov 17, 2013 5:07 pm

The GM... that'd be me... is actually pretty good at tactics and whatnot and has been intentionally staying out of this discussion because it feels a bit like cheating to help, even though in-character not only could I but I should (since Fierneceal also knew a bit about military tactics).

That being said, if you want to take this town intact Fierneceal is going to remain adamant that you use shock and awe blitzkrieg tactics; don't try to hold any territory, move in and defeat or demoralize then move on.  Leave the defeated yet not dead behind, bewildered.  If they take up arms again, it's not as much of an issue.  And be wary of that Fel Knight, that whole thing stinks of 'ace up sleeve'.

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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by K on Sun Nov 17, 2013 5:52 pm

Well yeah, that's the Fier Doctrine at work, just like at Janwall, and makes total sense, given our objective. It has to be done in the light, or it'll all be pointless.

The major IF, of course, is whether or not a handful of people can actually overwhelm a town's occupation force. It kinda worked at Janwall, because they were already fighting each other, but here we'll have their undivided attention.

Also, Gwydo, in character, i would argue that from the moment you're willing to stick your blade into your enemy, the means by which you carry said blade to stick into said enemy are of little consequence (within reason) compared to the fact that you are in fact sticking your blade into the enemy. So long as we're not committing any war crimes, fighting smart hardly seems like a sin in any creed save zealotry (not saying your character is one, just trying to make the point). As it stands, we actually need those people alive better than dead, so going in with non-lethal force is already pretty noble in and of itself, not to mention quite a strain on the group's fighting ability.

Also, while i agree with shock and awe, i would also argue that not all the enemy needs to be shocked and awed. If we could take as much of the enemy as we can by surprise (if Radnall could provide us with any insight into enemy positions, that would be great), i'm sure it'll still leave plenty of grunts whose spirit we must break when they finally know what's hitting them. If we could be surgical enough to take out their most vital areas first (early warning, archery nests, etc), that'd be a great help.

If Radnall can't provide any info, we should at the very least get our own, first. If someone could somehow infiltrate the town and run recon, or whatever other means of surveillance the exchange might have that could give us any idea what we're up against, this might look a little less suicidal.

In fact, i'm kinda shocked and awed myself that no one has yet talked about how to best recon this place before we launch an assault.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Gwydo on Sun Nov 17, 2013 6:14 pm

I thought Snarg Was going to run recon?
The deceit thing that I mention is more direct at Zeiss as he was suggesting tricking the Fel Knight and Greeta into getting them alone and/or backstabbing them sneakily. IN character I will not stand for this kind of trickery. OUT of character I can't argue with the tactical nature of taking the Fel Knight out before he is aware.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Essoje on Sun Nov 17, 2013 6:26 pm

The best way to recon any place is to send in the sneaky party members ahead, of course!

Edit: ... and hope the Dice Gods are in a good mood that day.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Snarg of Wildpaw on Sun Nov 17, 2013 7:04 pm

I did run recon briefly last session and that was where we got the info on the arms and fortification status. I'm also assuming that's why we have the map as it is.

Nothing much more to add since my last post. I'm still set on using shock tactics and since Fier agrees, I think that's what we should do.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by K on Sun Nov 17, 2013 7:37 pm

Well, this is awkward. Guess i should have payed attention.

Then looking at ze map, ze northwest seems ze most vulnerable (i know this was mentioned). We also have a semi-clear path to ze barracks from there, which, if we want to alpha-strike to the greatest effect, i'm guessing going in quiet as far as we can and then blitzing the barracks, where most soldiers are likely gathered (and where their gear is likely stored), and the least prepared, would best serve our purpose. I'm guessing at night would be when the patrols are more lax, and the time when the barracks would be more densely packed. With tired soldiers, no less.

Losing a chunk of their manpower off the bat would likely throw their forces into a good bit of disarray. The problem would then be mopping them up after, and of course, the Fell Knight. Facing him by itself worries me, of course, but all the trash supporting him would make it that much harder. The northern bridge seems like a good choke point in case we need to counter their numbers, but that might cut us off too (or provide us an escape route, if things go from bad to worse and we don't mind swimming, but rivers normally run south, i think, meaning we'd need to get past a lot of fortifications still, and some of our guys are wearing armor).

Also, the round structure in the warehouse district catches my eye.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Zeiss on Sun Nov 17, 2013 8:43 pm

Yeah, I am against the idea of holding territory.

That idea was so obvious to me that I didn't think to mention it. We just find the soldiers, beat them up then move on to the next area. If the Fel Knight arrives with other soldiers, we make Thog appear (unless another situation forces us to use that tactic earlier).

If we do this the smart way, I'm not really worried about that battle.

Let's just attack the least defended/patrolled part of town. Oh, and we do NOT split up. If at some point we are too injured to continue to fight, we just retreat then come back later.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by K on Sun Nov 17, 2013 9:09 pm

I'd hold that thought of not splitting up unless you plan on storming the town from it's very edge. If we mean to reach any kind of value target within the town before we start wrecking havoc, it's imperative we travel under the radar, and a larger group will undoubtedly attract more attention than scattered individuals. That means scattering and converging on target.

Also, if we mean to jump the barracks, we should do them simultaneously, which means splitting into 2, unless it's acceptable to have the building we leave for last gear up and storm us in turn (it's not). And as for retreating, well, if we're able to retreat from an occupied town once we're in the middle of it by our lonesome, with armed soldiers swarming us from all sides, that'll be a sight almost as impressive as finishing the job in the first place. Not to mention that if we do retreat, we'll lose all the shock&awe momentum and our capacity to break their will, leaving aside what it'll say about our ability to overwhelm them in the first place. A second attack would be nowhere near as effective; not to mention that while we recuperated, they'd have ample time to resupply and replenish their forces, and heighten their readiness.

In short, if their security is any kind of lax right now, it's a one time opportunity for us. We won't get another if we botch it.

EDIT: Did Snarg's recon score us a description of the barracks? How large, how many floors, windows, entry and exit points? Also, any idea on what those towers are packing?
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Zeiss on Sun Nov 17, 2013 9:47 pm

Against the idea of splitting up to attack both barracks. I think we will survive this only if we attack together.

I doubt, very much, we'll be able to pass under the radar to attack the barracks. We have a lot of people who can't do stealth at all.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by K on Sun Nov 17, 2013 10:14 pm

Never thought i'd be quoting the character who brought this point up, but it's about staying unknown, not hidden. If we can maybe cover up enough of our flashier members (put a big cloak on Gwydo?) to even half-blend in with the crowd, i think it's worth a shot.

And Zeiss, if you or anyone else have some other value target we should go after, or want to make a case for just randomly wrecking havoc in town, i'm all ears. As for the barracks, i'm pretty sure i've done a halfway decent job of pointing out the facts on the ground that make doing one at a time a really bad idea, unless someone thinks i've missed something.

If you think the points i've brought up previously are bullcrap, that's fine too, as long as you'd please explain why.
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Zeiss on Sun Nov 17, 2013 10:57 pm

Firts, is there even a crowd to blend in? I would be surprised if that was the case. Especially if we attack at night.

Second, I agree we should attack their barracks. I only believe we will have to fight our way there. Unless you guys let me lie to these people.

Third point : splitting up to attack different places would divide our force of attack. Which isn't that big when you compare it to their troops. I would suggest guerilla tactics.


Ans question : did Snarg and me have the time to go with the Fire trial?

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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Gwydo on Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:06 pm

K wrote:Never thought i'd be quoting the character who brought this point up, but it's about staying unknown, not hidden. If we can maybe cover up enough of our flashier members (put a big cloak on Gwydo?) to even half-blend in with the crowd, i think it's worth a shot.
Do we have a holocaust cloak?

Ah, if only we had the modern convenience of C4 and remote detonators, we could just blow up the barracks...
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by K on Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:10 pm

Fighting our way to the barracks, and therefore making our presence known before we reach them, makes attacking the barracks pointless to begin with, as they'll all be empty, with all their contents now armed, ready and alert, and on their way to kill us.

If we can't blend into the crowd (IF), we'll have to find some other way to sneak through. Maybe get a cart with hay or supplies and hide the unstealthy party members there, or maybe find the least patrolled routes during night or day, maybe check to see if the town was any waterworks or any other underground network we can use, or check for whatever other kind of transit the streets most often see (pretty sure Snarg would have seen THAT) and try to blend in with that.

From the moment we say attack the barracks, or anything else that's within the town that requires the element of surprise to be able to pull it off successfully, we have to think up a way to do just that. If we say we can't or won't, the whole thing is rendered moot, and we're right back to just randomly storming the town all the way from the edge of it and hope for the best.

And answer (Zeiss): The time they did have, but Snarg didn't take it, and Arch assumed you wouldn't want to either, since your character apparently said at some point that he would never take one of those trials again.


Last edited by K on Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Archengeia on Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:55 pm

Also I didn't feel like coming up with the Fire Trial on the fly with little to go on.  I didn't even describe the Fire Temple in character.

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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Zeiss on Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:31 am

Hmm...

Well, Zeiss would have taken the Fire trial because of a RP reason I hinted at in my journal. And K is right, Zeiss did say he wouldn't take any other trial. But then Rekkarg came and said "you guys should take the trials, because power! Maybe".

Now Zeiss doesn't remember gaining a mysterious power, so the only reason he wants to take the trial is because of spoiler spoiler. And also because I am curious to see what the trial is. It's'your fault Arch for making interesting trials! Razz

Now, the wagon idea is good. But I wonder where we can find one. And if the patrols are going to check them.

But there is a river... Let's'swim?
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Rory on Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:30 am

How about a sewer system?
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Archengeia on Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:10 am

You don't know this for fact but the sewage system is probably a more mundane system then what the major cities utilize, probably aqueducts and tunnels leading out to the river or to a processing facility, could be either (or both).

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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

Post by Zeiss on Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:55 am

Until we can confirm anything (presence of wagon, sewers big enough for a Lugian to fit in, etc.), I am in favor of attacking the weakest part of town. We get as near as possible by using stealth, of course, but let's'not put all our hopes on that. We only need to get near.

By the way Rory, is your character okay with letting Thog in for a moment? Or maybe I should say out... Whatever. You know what I mean. :@
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Re: Battle Plans for Irondell

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