Gauging Interest in a Short Campaign

Finding different ways or forming scenarios with which to tempt each PC uniquely would be a great way to handle the Dark Side.

Very doable K. Playing a surviving Padawan is actually the only way I'm going to allow you guys to start in the Jedi class.

I'll post up some more info for you later but in the mean time here are some links you may find useful.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Padawan

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Jedi_training

@Rory: Yes, that is exactly right. I'll be using a combination of custom and general temptations so when I have more time I'll be asking you, K, and anyone else who is interested more about their characters.

While we're waiting, I've been messing around with the Star Wars SagaE Core Rulebook, which you can download here(note, everyone keep in mind that this is not likely to be the same as Kolson's rules for this campaign):
https://www.4shared.com/document/GbuPPEVP/Star_Wars_Saga_Edition_-_Core_.html

and a character planner, found here(again, working on rules that are not the same, you'll notice that the species list is much longer in comparison to Kolson's rules, and racial modifiers are likely to vary between the books' rules and Kolson's:
http://www.starwarsrpgindex.com/star-wars-rpg-index-character-planner.php

So don't blame me when Kolson's done with his rules and they're radically different! I'll certainly be kicking myself in the head if they out like that.

Kolson, the Chiss seem to be appropriate for Knowledge-based builds. I'm looking at having the following Knowledges:
Philosophy, Criminology, Xenobiology, Anticipate Strategy, Battlefield Tactics.
Those are under Social, Life, and Tactics. I have to wonder if the broader ones are taken as all-inclusive, but that would be kind of a letdown. A person can study philosophy and master it, and know almost nothing about criminology(which are both under Social Sciences).

However, I'm making a build with the Soldier class, which means I also prefer the following skills:
Endurance, Climb, Jump, Swim, Perception

Those ones will probably be consolidated into 2-3 skills, preferably 2, which would allow me to fit all of them in. In the end, it'll depend on what my racial modifiers are(the character planner gives the Chiss +2 to Int). Being Force-Sensitive, I am of course taking Use the Force, and I have 3(maximum) Force Powers in mind for my character.

I plan on doing a Force Powers brainstorm for anyone taking Force-Sensitivity, and will start that as soon as we get to see the rules and figure out our attributes(specifically Wisdom, and Charisma apparently cannot be lower than 0).

My first Talent is going to be Force Pilot, but I'll also put 1 rank in Pilot because background(and never touch it again, lol).

Just some stuff to think about, but I'm okay with knocking off a few 
Knowledges to for better focus on the core skills of my PC if it comes to that. I'm sure the finished rules are going to be different from what I'm looking at, so don't be worried. I'm just excited and I needed something to practice on.

Personal choices in Force Powers I would like to see available: Force Stun, Resist Force, Mind Shard

I'd prefer it if you guys didn't download questionable pdfs that may or may not give you trojans and viruses, but who am I to stop you? Not like I'll know the difference. Just realize my stuff will have all of the errata included.

Anyway, there are no skill ranks in SAGA. You are either trained in the skill or you or not. If you are, you get (Attribute mod + 1/2 level rounded down + 5) in the skill. If you want to be really good at it, take Skill Focus for an additional +5 competence bonus. The end. No muss, no fuss.

Knowlege skills are collections of disciplines in SAGA. For example, if you take Knowledge (life sciences) you'll know all about biology, botany, genetics, archaeology, xenobiology, medicine, and forensics.

Now you might say: "Kolson? Why would I know about all those things? What if I just want biology?" Well, my answer is that Star Wars is a setting that's based on the old science fiction pulp stories of the 40s and 50s, where knowledgeable heroes dabbled in lots of disciplines because they were heroes. In setting up the skills that way they've minimized the amount of times you'll need to track down an expert in whatever you happen to be doing at the time which keeps the story centered squarely on you--where it should be. So no, I won't be breaking knowledge skills into individual disciplines.

That said, I will be collapsing Run, Jump, and Climb into one skill called, surprise, surprise, Athletics. It's such a common houserule that even the original creator wishes he had written it that way.

I also greatly limit species options in games with folks new to the rules so they have some place to start and don't try to use one of the species that are more appropriate for experienced players, like say wookies (They can't speak basic which is a huge hurdle to overcome for anyone, much less newbs.).

@Rory: If you want to train in Pilot and take Force Pilot I won't stop you, but just know you are mechanically better off doing one or the other and in all likelihood you'll have a higher Dexterity mod. Just saying. Also, how did you learn to use the Force? Did someone teach you? Did you find an old holocron? Are you secretly a member of a non-Jedi Force Tradition? Let me know after you think about it and we can discuss it some more.

Reviewing Force Powers to see what I will and won't be allowing is still on my to-do list but I'll keep those in mind. Off the top of my head Sever Force and Phasing are definitely out. They are better for higher level and solo play respectively.

Err, yes, that's correct. Make sure your computer is protected with by a firewall and an antivirus client. this PDF seems to be safe, as far as I've seen.

I guess that's okay. It certainly narrows down all those different Knowledges and gives space for other skills I want.

I wanted my character to discover it on his own and realize, "oh, Force" and trace that back to his seemingly natural ability at piloting in the second seat. But you are right, I am going for a higher Dex mod, so I'll scrap that and stick with Piloting.

Nobody taught me before campaign start, I was hoping to be taught or discover it on my own after the start, so I won't be using powers or taking Force Talents. Does the Force skill have to be unlocked before I can "train" it?

Here's a list of macros by editions/versions for force powers to tell you exactly what each power does to help you determine whether you'll allow it. There's another list of the powers with descriptions, but for some reason, the explicit effects aren't listed, but they are in the macros.
http://adrianrp.wikispot.org/Star_Wars_Saga/Power_Macros

Here's a link to a list of feats, provided for the same purpose.
http://adrianrp.wikispot.org/Star_Wars_Saga/Feat_Descriptions

I got what you were going for Rory but there is nothing saying you aren't a great pilot because of your Force Sensitivity. You just wouldn't have Force Pilot is all.

But to answer your question, you'd have the Force Sensitivity feat, which adds Use the Force to your class skill list, but you wouldn't train it when making your character. That would leave you with a basic use of the Force, like getting bad feelings about something or some action you are about to do or occasionally sensing a hidden foe. That kind of thing.

Training would then come as the result of an event, like finding a teacher or an old holocron and studying it. After you successfully completed a few tests, I'd then reward you with training in the skill for free.

@K Anything in particular you'd like background info on? Have you decided on a species yet?

Also, what kind of Jedi are you interested in being? Examples:

1. Yshrim Na is a Togruta Jedi focused on lightsaber combat. As he levels up, he splits his time between the Guardian and Lightsaber Talent trees, focusing on talents, feats, and powers that help him protect others and defeat foes with his sword.

2. Itzi is a Miraluka Jedi who focuses on the Force. As she levels up, she splits her time between the Consular and the Alter talent trees, focusing on talents, feats, and powers that help her master telekinetic Force powers.

3. Kale Arin is a human Jedi, focused on investigation and criminology. As he levels up, he splits his time between the Sense, Sentinel, and Lightsaber talent trees, focusing on talents, feats, and powers that help him ferret out and defeat those who would prey on the innocent.

Any details you could give would be helpful.

@Third and Zeiss Any idea what you guys want to play? So far we have a former Outer Rim prison guard and a surviving Jedi Padawan. Some healing would be nice, as would a face.

Oh, 'k. So I'd have to have Force Sensitivity to make Use the Force checks, but I wouldn't be able to make trained Force checks until I finish studying it(darn, the document even tells you that). Okay. So what I'm gonna go for is being aware of the "powers" I have such as(examples from the document) Search Feelings, Sense Surroundings, and Telepathy, but one caveat: I'm not in control of when these checks occur(whether or not that's how it works mechanically). I'll let you decide when those happen. Should be fun and games for you. And while I have heard of the Force, I'm not aware that my "powers" and the Force are one and the same. I'll have my PC learn about that when, say, K's Jedi(or an PC/NPC with the knowledge/Wisdom) learns I'm Force sensitive and tells me I am.

If it comes down to Force tradition, I'd prefer neither Light nor Dark, no "come-to-class" style, and no focus on ideal, but leaving the idealism up to the apprentice, while informing the apprentice of the following: the risks, as opposed to dangers, of the Dark Side; and the egotistic extreme of the Light Side.

Instead, the primary focus should be that if you have the talent, don't waste it. Find a use for it that suits your interests and practice it. If you're a soldier, find a combat use for it; if you're an architect, find a constructive outlet for it; if you're a doctor, find a medical purpose for it, and so on, but leaving the exact method of application(or Powers) to be interpreted by the individual.

I'll leave the "teacher or holocron or [other]" decision up to you. Surprise me.

I'm not going for healing, I can tell you that, since I am a cleric in Snarg's campaign.

I thought about being the witty criminal who smuggles things and serves as the comic relief when he has time. I will discuss the details with you Kolson through Steam.

Zeiss wrote:witty criminal who smuggles things and serves as the comic relief

So how is this new character any different from Zeiss?

He's comic relief.

Well, i had the story in strokes, but i guess i kept it vague and hidden long enough, so let me try and flesh it out.

As for his species, i thought Lorrdian. I know it's not on your list, but it's pretty much a close offshot of human, so i figure the skillset would be near-identical.

Ominae Yu (stole it) is a Padawan focused on lighsaber combat. He's one of three brothers (one bro, one sis), from an impoverished family on the Outer Rim. He's small for his age (early teens, most like), so his affinity for Form IV  comes in handy. When the Purge began, he and his master, Vornar Tev (made it up), were inside the Jedi temple, just back from a mission that had left them exhausted. Vornar (can he be a Schenor? I want him to have been tall.) took it upon himself to protect as many of the younglings as he possibly could. Ominae tried his hardest to help him, but it seemed to him as for every advantage he could afford him, he would become almost as much of a liability in turn, as Vornar had to protect him as well on multiple occasions. As they were making it out the temple, and escape started to seem within grasp, they were ambushed by a squad of clone troopers, mowing down almost half their younglings in the initial barrage. Vornar and Ominae took formation around the survivors, shielding them as much as possible, but their efforts just weren't enough against the tactical advantage and sheer number of the opposition, and amidst the chaos, Ominae's awareness told him Vornar was still protecting his flank, picking up his slack even as his own mind struggled to keep up. As their injuries piled on, more and more children fell victim to baster fire, until the two were protecting a circle of dead younglings. Almost back to back now, Ominae didn't even need the force to tell him his master's condition, as his very breath was becoming strained and gurgled, like a dying beast on his next to final breath. His instinct was to turn back and support him, but he knew he'd be killing them both if he did. As the clones prepared for what would certainly be their final volley, Vornar stood taut, took one final breath and let out a massive roar that sent the Force blasting at the entire room, knocking down the soldiers, cracking walls and taking out about half the power in the hall. Ominae's already battered lightsaber finally gave out under the shock. As he got his bearings back, he sensed Vornar stumble and fall over. Turning around, he caught his master's massive frame before he hit the ground, but he knew the sight of someone who's life was all but drained. As he lay dying, too weak to talk, Vornar raised a hand to pat his pupil's shoulder one last time, but his failing strength barely allowed him to make contact before it collapsed to the floor, lifeless.

Ominae had little time to grieve, as he sensed the troopers recovering all around him. Suddenly, all the pain and trauma, coupled with the exhaustion, made his emotions flare up. He picked up his master's oversized lighsaber, and in a rage, took the opening and lunged at the clones in a leaping whirlwind of death.

When the last trooper had been reduced to charred chunks of armor, Ominae's dark rage still smoldered, until he instinctively caught back the sight of his fallen master and yougnlings, and a sharp pain mixed with horror overtook him as the events he had gone through finally caught up with him and started stabbing at him everywhere that didn't already hurt from the strain. Normally, he would have thought to talk to his master about such things, but now, nothing was making sense anymore.

The brief dreadful respite was interrupted the sound what would surely be Republic reinforcements closing in on him. As he instinctively turned to run, his body froze for a moment as he looked back at the fallen bodies of his master and friends. The thought of leaving them there for the troopers to desecrate was enough to make his stomach turn. But he knew the only thing he could do now was either leave them or join them. He gripped his master's lightsaber tighter until his hand started shaking, as he forced himself to look away, turn around, and run for his life.

I honestly try to keep things short. I do.

Ominae is in a rather bad place for a Jedi, besides the obvious. He has to deal with loss, survivor guilt, and his brush with the Dark Side. He also very much wants to go back to his family, both out of worry and the trauma he's suffered, but he won't dare get close to home, for fear of endangering them further.

And, uh... that's all i got.

Oh yeah, and the "i" in his name is pronounced as in "omni", rather than "my". The "a" is like in "ah" rather than "ay". Just throwing it out there.

Zeiss wrote:He's comic relief.

He's also witty. Hoho!

Well done K. That's a great start. We'll just have to figure out how to get you off Coruscant and to -Spoiler-. Perhaps a certain witty smuggler would be helpful in that regard.

Lorridan for Ominae is approved as is Schenor for Vornar Tev.

Lorridan stats:

Great Lightsaber:

A great lightsaber isn't really ideal for an Ataru practitioner of your size so you'll want to find someone who can alter it to something more your speed or find a replacement. The Empire has also declared lightsabers illegal so you'll want to take pains to hide it when you are out and about. Unfortunately it's size will be an issue.

Aren't there any feats like Monkey Grip, that would allow me to wield oversized weapons? Also, couldn't i try to repair my own, or do we assume i just dropped it? (Sorry, i didn't think to cover that part, and i don't want to be greedy.)

He could always hide it in his pants...

Considering that Force Scream is an ability only Dark Side Force users are capable of activating, I'd think Ominae has already been leaning that way before,  with his "brush" only being the turning point where the influence of the Dark Side in his personal conflict between Light and Darkness becomes significantly stronger and throws him deeper into said conflict.

Hey, how 'bout them Chiss stats?

I had no idea there was a force scream.

Quickly before I go off, Kolson, I've got the correct link for those Power macros here, and I'll correct my earlier post as well:
http://adrianrp.wikispot.org/Star_Wars_Saga/Power_Macros

And here's a list of all of them with generic descriptors if you just want to glance at them and get a simple description of what they do:
http://adrianrp.wikispot.org/Star_Wars_Saga/Power_Descriptions

K: Oh definitely. The following page explains it in detail with notable examples.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Force_scream

I did some more looking, and it turns out there's also Force Bellow, which doesn't say one way or the other, but you wouldn't be able to cause damage with it.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Force_bellow

If you like, you can switch to Force Shockwave, which is an AoE power, if Kolson ends up adding it in. It accomplishes the same effect.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Force_Shockwave

Force Scream's effect is explained to be shockwaves through the force which damage objects and other matter nearby, and ripple across the force to be distantly felt by Force users.
Force Bellow, on the other hand, is simply a power used to amplify the user's voice, and only Force-using Ithorians can push air strongly enough through their throats to cause damage with it.

If Force Shockwave is a d20 Power, it isn't listed anywhere. Kolson, if you want to allow Shockwave or an equivalent/custom power of the same effects, I'd suggest making its range shorter than what Force Scream's is, or a bit less powerful, or something. Force Scream is described as involuntary, so if you want to roll with that, I'd give them differing effects or make Scream hurt more.

My choice Powers aren't set in stone. I am hoping that there will be what's basically a mind-affecting version of Stun. Also, I'm gonna throwing out my Resist Force choice for something Telekinetic(Force Push/Thrust or Move Object). Choosing multiple enemies(a feat, let's say), possibly with the trade-off of reduced damage or penalized DC would be a cool feature.

For anyone who's confused, Move Light Object is a Use Force check, not a power, while Move Object is a combat version that allows you to throw possibly heavier objects instead, or light objects much harder.

Well, that was informative. Still, if i have to unexpectedly admit Vornar might have had an affinity with the dark side, i would add that he would most certainly have protected his padawan from it.

Spoiler question for Kolson because I don't care about 'em, but other people might.

Campaign Timeline:

Answer for Rory:

Chiss:

Don't forget to take Basic as one of your trained languages when we make characters on Thursday. Also, why is your character in the Outer Rim and not in Chiss space? Did something happen to cause your family to leave or what?

@K You can wield the weapon, that's not the problem. It's the fact that it's too big and heavy for Weapon Finesse to apply for creatures your size (in game terms, Ominae is Medium, while his master's lightsaber was made and balanced for Large creatures. Understand?). Ataru users favor Dexterity over Strength, so taking Weapon Finesse is something they all do so they can use Dex for attack rolls instead of Str. As you can read, great lightsabers don't allow creatures smaller than Large (again, you are Medium) to use feats like Weapon Finesse. Hence why your master's lightsaber is not ideal.

If you want to add a bit about taking your broken lightsaber with you that's fine with me, as is not breaking it in the first place. It's just, your story is pretty cool as is, you know?

Also, don't worry about your master using the Dark Side. I know exactly what he did and it wasn't Force Scream. Yelling out one last act of defiance while you try to buy time for your Padawan to escape doesn't automatically mean Dark Side Force power, you know?

I don't see anything in the Wookiee pages concerning Chiss activity between 138 BBY and the Clone Wars, or bold Sith/Empire activity/establishment, or interaction with the Chiss, during those periods, basically anything that might make me or my family want to leave. "Studying abroad" or something of that nature seems to be ill-advised in their culture, if not outright discouraged. If it comes to worst, I could have him leaving on the self-appointed task to gather intelligence in the regions of the Outer Rim closer to the galactic core, taking mercenary work while seeking law enforcement opportunities, but that feels like a stretch.

Throw me a bone. What are my possibilities?

Also, I just read that Chiss capable of using the Force are fewer than .5% of their population, so that should be a treat.


By the way, are we going to be using Third's Vent server, or are you creating your own? Or are we using Steam chat?

Off the top of my head:

1. Private colony made up of Chiss renegades. The Outer Rim is made up of many small colonies on many uncharted or poorly charted worlds. Your guy could have originated there but left to find his own life for reasons.

2. Your guy's family was on the losing end of a power struggle and rather than face prison time they went into exile in the Outer Rim. You grew up in the Republic and have never seen your homeworld.

3. You were stolen and sold into slavery for a time, eventually winning your way free. Perhaps you were rescued by the authorities of a certain world and worked on joining them when you were old enough.

4. You were on the losing end of a power struggle within the Chiss government and went into exile in what was at the time the Republic. Since you still need to eat, you decided to put your law enforcement training to good use and the rest is history. This also leaves open the possibility that you and/or your family participated in the Clone Wars.

5. You were an explorer and a bit of a renegade in your youth. Rather than stick around like a good little Chiss drone, you went out to see what you could see. What you found was pretty amazing but you eventually grew wary of your travels and decided to settle down and rest for a bit. Your skills naturally lend themselves to law enforcement so you found work in that capacity.

Note: A Scout would be a better class to start in for this background due to their fantastic skill selection. Also, you wouldn't necessarily have to be a prison guard, you'd just be in law enforcement in general. Maybe a detective or private eye.

We'll be using Third's Vent server for the game. Speaking of which, our first session will be tomorrow at the usual time. We'll be making characters and talking about backgrounds and such.

I chose #3, with additional details. As of campaign start, I will be a self-employed private investigator.

I converted my notes to Scout class, and I love it. I was originally hoping to make an armored "psychic soldier" build, but I think I can settle for the "paranormal private investigator" type.

I've noticed that some of the prestige classes require minimum heroic level of 7. A prestige class becomes available at heroic level 7 and the PC takes the first level of the prestige class at character level 8, he is basically skipping over the bonus feat he would normally get at level 8. Whatever the requirements for prestige classes happen to be in your campaign, the minimum heroic level requirement shouldn't overlap with bonus feat levels, at least in the case of a PC of 1 basic class taking 1 prestige class requiring a minimum heroic level, and instead overlap with said basic class's "talent-gaining" levels. My point is that a player might want to take the prestige class with the intention of never going back to the base class.

But if you plan for bonus feats to be part of the Character levels, I guess that's cool.

It's part of the trade off of taking a prestige class. A PRC gives you access to talent trees and a unique class mechanic you won't be able to get any other way. I find it makes building the character more interesting and challenging.

The way it is now, you'll end up asking yourself "How many levels of the PRC should I take? Do I want a feat or [insert class feature here]? What is the minimum of class X that I can take and still meet my character concept?" I think those are good questions to be asking yourself when leveling up because I believe it makes the crunch part of the game fun too.

A big thanks to everyone who showed up.

K, we'll need to figure out your character. Let me know when you can do it.